″ We are waiting for authorization to buy 17 new trains ″
Vitor Domingues dos Santos has been leading the Lisbon Metro since January 2017. After staunching material failures in the beginning of his term, the path of the president of the capital’s metro has been marked by the network’s expansion works.
Before we talk about the future: how many users did the Lisbon Metro have in the last month and how does it compare to November 2019?
We continue to slowly recover the demand that occurred in 2019. We closed with around 60% [dos utentes] that happened in 2019. In the last days of November, we were a little better, surpassing two thirds. We are on the right path, but it is still a long way to go until we recover the demand that occurred in 2019.
There is still a part of users who have not returned.
It is an expressive part, of a third of the regular subway users. It will probably have a lot to do with the pandemic – we’ll look at the process in the near future – the greater recourse to work at home and the growth of e-commerce – people are looking for fewer stores and commercial spaces for their purchases. We have a projection that the path is slow. We’re aiming for a full customer recovery in 2024 or 2025. It’s doing better than initial expectations.
What were the initial expectations?
We are a little lower in demand, between 50% and 60%.
About network expansion: when will the new Estrela and Santos stations open?
The start-up will be in 2024.
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In what period?
No second semester. We have two separate contracts that come together on the circular line: the most visible is the construction of the tunnels and the two stations; then we have a modernization. The most important part is the alteration of the external signage, an old system that when we started the process of expanding the network we didn’t think about investing. We quickly came to the conclusion that our system was so old that we could no longer get parts to enhance the current solution. The announcements are good timing because we are going to have a new system, for now, on three lines and then on all, which gives us the conditions to work with greater safety and which lowers the train circulation intervals.
In May, the Court of Auditors gave prior approval for the purchase of 14 new trains and a new signaling system, for 114 and a half million euros. When will this material reach the network?
In the second half of 2024. At this point, we are already in full control of the manufacturing of rolling stock, in Valencia, where the underground teams have already been. We have already started to define the models and we are going, with the workers’ committees, to visit the cabins of the future of machinists. In 2023 we will receive the first carriage. From then on, the material will reach the end of 2024. We expect to start operating the circular line in the second half of 2024.
After the works are completed, what should be the new operating model for the Lisbon Metro? The mayor of Lisbon, Carlos Moedas, defends the looped line. Why the circular line?
The line was a circular result of the studies carried out and is the most favorable solution in technical, economic and environmental terms. Brings more passengers to the subway. That was the choice criterion. We are following the first report of the expansion plan defined in 2009, approved at the time by the Secretary of State for Transport [Ana Paula Vitorino]: creating a circular ring. At the time, the tutelage provided 200 million for the investment. We analyzed two options: the circular line and the connection from São Sebastião station to Campo de Ourique. In the case of the circular line and the connection from Rato to Cais do Sodré, we have also studied two variants: operation in a ring or with two axes centered on Cais do Sodré, one for Odivelas and the other for Telheiras.
Have the studies considered the option for the loop line?
The loop option corresponds to the two half loops. The loop solution benefits a third of passengers, who move from Odivelas to the south of Campo Grande, but harms people who want to stay in Campo Grande. People who are already staying in Campo Grande will have great advantages: they will have a line with frequency intervals of three minutes and 30 seconds, reaching their place of work much faster. People who leave Odivelas today and whose destination is the stations south of Campo Grande, in the future, even with the transfer, they will be able to make up for lost time because they will have less waiting time: there are fewer circulation breaks in both directions, less than two minutes and 40 seconds.
Can’t that exclude how people who live north of Campo Grande? It will force them to make a transshipment that does not currently exist.
Any metro infrastructure has transfers: there are people who transfer in Marquês de Pombal, Cais do Sodré, Sete Rios, São Sebastião, Alameda… We have many situations in this sense. It is normal and common that in daily use of the metro there are overflows. We have to understand that when we study alternative solutions we have economic, technical and environmental criteria. From the studies that have been announced, we conclude that there is a difference of four to five million passengers/year between the option of the circular line and the extension of the red line and the half-loop system. It does not separate the study from the loop because the option is very similar to that of the half loops. Circulation in a continuous loop undermines the centrality of transport in the center of Lisbon. The purpose of the circular line is to distribute urban routes and try to make suburban routes considered as a second level of movement.
The two main candidates for the Lisbon council were not in agreement on the option for the circular line. Carlos Moedas defended the solution in a loop. Have you already talked to Carlos Coins?
I’ve already had two meetings with the president and I’ve already explained to him how we got to the circular line. He religious me, but I assume he maintains the opinion he has always conveyed to us.
Do you think it will be possible to reach an understanding?
The Metropolitano de Lisboa intervenes in the city. The company has to have a great relationship with the mayor. In the circular line aspect, the administration fulfills what it is developing. The project was approved by the tutelage, which is responsible for the decision to change the situation if this initiative is taken. The president of the metro is going to implement a circular line, which is what he was appointed for.
Can only the guardianship change the project?
For sure.
Isn’t it metro itself?
Absolutely not. The Metropolitano de Lisboa responds to the tutelage, the Ministry of Environment and Climate Action, and complies with its indications.
Do these works, even when completed, only allow the circular line or possible other exploration models?
As the project is selected, the circular line and other movements are possible. The minister of Environment and Climate Action has already explained that it is possible to connect trains that come from Odivelas and then enter the circular line. We consider this not to be an effective operating model.
There is also a proposal for the surface light rail between Loures and Odivelas, worth 250 million euros. Who will operate this line?
In principle, it will be the Lisbon Metro. This is what is on the basis of the concession and without a diploma approved by the Council of Ministers.
What rolling stock can be used and what is the connection with the rest of the metro network?
The solution we recommend is the first implementation of a circular ring that forms an arc of public transport around Lisbon and that brings together the municipalities of Oeiras, Amadora, Odivelas and Loures. This project lives by itself: it has a length of 12 kilometers and will link an important set of analysis between Beatriz Ângelo’s hospital and Infantado. We are developing the project, but the municipality of Loures has also changed. There were studies developed with the previous councilor; In the coming weeks, we are going to meet with the mayors of Odivelas and Loures to fix and finally lay down the definitive route.
What rolling stock will be used?
The investment includes: 12 kilometers of infrastructure, signaling and energy; a workshop park and the supply of rolling stock. We estimate that there are 12 trains for the operation of this line, which will be independent and will have a proximity interface with the Odivelas metro station. Our goal is to create a line with journey times of 20 minutes between Infantado and Odivelas for people to move between different combinations of municipalities and as a catalyst for the heavier line in Odivelas.
If a passenger wants to travel between Loures and Campo Grande will he have to change trains?
Yes. They are independent systems. We are talking about a light metro, with smaller trains, similar to the (light) metro in Porto or the Metro Sul do Tejo (Almada and Seixal). The problem of public transport is very complex: urban growth in cities has not always been conducted in a planned way. The populations of urban locations north of Lisbon are several sets of spaces, with densities of 10, 15, 20 thousand people. It is always very difficult, for any means of transport, to make a perfect interconnection between these clusters. The light rail allows you to do this: it is easier to implement, it is surface and walks on the streets of cars. In a way, it helps to remove more cars from circulation. It has an important environmental impact.
What is the timetable for the expansion of the red line and when will the metro reach Amoreiras, Campo de Ourique, Infante Santo and Alcântara?
The red line project is in the final stage of delivering the environmental impact study, scheduled for the first weeks of this month. After approval of the study and environmental impact statement, we will, in parallel, prepare the contract tenders, which will take place in 2022. Still next year, we hope to be able to contract some of the contracts, which will take place in 2023, 2024 and 2025. go into operation in 2026.
How much does this work cost?
We have an approved investment of 304 million euros for the Recuperar Portugal mission structure, but 285 million euros will be used for this project.
Can the red line expansion be done without purchasing new rolling stock?
We are awaiting the approval of the Council of Ministers resolution for the purchase of another 17 triple units. The tender would be held in early 2022, for the material to arrive in time for expansion to be ready.
He has chaired Metropolitano de Lisboa since 2017 and is now in his second term. When does the current exercise end?
In February 2022.
Would you like to see the projects under construction come to fruition?
It will be difficult: some of the projects run until 2026 and terms are three years. A term starting in 2022 would end at the end of 2024. It is a decision that does not belong to me. But I am available to continue to exercise functions. The decision is up to the guardianship.