Demographer: Life on Václavák is like a pre-heart attack. Prague vs. Brno is a myth
According to the demographics of Radim Perlín, the arrival of 300,000 Ukrainians in the Czech Republic means potential for rural development. According to him, he is still not doing as he should. Therefore, some areas continue to be depopulated and threatened with extinction. “I always tell mayors to respect everyone who does something in their village, even if it is a disco for teenagers. It also helps that people will want to stay in the village,” says Perlín.
From the Prague point of view, it may seem that while the capital determines trends in terms of gastronomy, in small municipalities, 90 companies still predominate. For example, in the Turnov region from time to time I observe the opening of a modern restaurant or cafe run by young people. Can it be understood that even smaller communities are developing?
It is necessary to look at it from two perspectives. It depends on the internal and external conditions. The interior can not be affected, it is mainly the location of the village. Turnov is located on one of the most advanced development axes in the Czech Republic, so we call the area Pilsen – Prague – Mladá Boleslav – Liberec. This is the main direction of development. There is a lot of social, social and cultural life. So it is doing much better there, for example, in the area between Česká Lípa and Nový Bor.
Radim Perlín, Head of the Research Center for Rural Geography at the Faculty of Science, Charles University Photo: Radim Perlín Archive
The second reason why things are going well is the internal conditions. And you can already be affected. There is something going on in the village, events are taking place there and it is therefore interesting to live there. A group of people there provide a cultural and social program, so people are doing well there. In the case of Turnov, it may be a different program connected with life in the Bohemian Paradise. It is not tempting to live somewhere where the nearest ring is 25 kilometers away. But if you need football, amateur theater, suddenly you will have your activity, friends and you will have fun there. Then there is no reason not to live there or put the child to school. So when good external and internal conditions come together, then the community can prosper.
How much will I add to the village, for example, a new, modern cafe?
Too much, sometimes it’s a clear example of development. On the other hand, opening such a cafe can sometimes be a dead end, a fad that no one has calculated economically. Such a device then closes quickly again. According to most such devices, it arises where there is a will and a need to see each other, to have fun together.
When people in a given village start having fun together, they also start talking about what program it would be good to have in the village, what to improve and so on. And they start doing something. Maybe they will create their own calendar, an amateur film, the children will take care of each other. The stronger such interaction is, the greater the chance that the community will continue to develop.
However, there are still communities in the Czech Republic that are depopulating, young people are moving to the cities to work, and this is also related to the lack of services or social life. So how much is the Czechia still struggling with the depopulation of the countryside and how successful is it?
I do not agree with the concept of rural depopulation. It is about depopulation of only some parts of the Czech countryside. For example, Kladno is not depopulated and it is also rural. But it’s happening elsewhere. And that’s a big problem. When the village is in a bad position, it is off the main roads, there is no work, it can also be related to the fact that social and cultural life will slow down or stop there completely. And this is exactly what is important so that the community does not die down. People have to meet, have fun.
They must have a leader among themselves who will organize the event and who others who are not so active will respect. Thanks to this, people will gain a sense of identity, they will create real social networks. He is often the leader of the municipality, this is an ideal case. I always tell mayors to respect everyone who does something in their community, even if it is a disco for teenagers who would not be interested at all. This is also a social activity that helps people want to stay in the village. But it doesn’t work everywhere.
Where is the biggest problem with rural depopulation?
Especially where there are small villages with a small population and from where it is far to big cities. We record the largest population declines in the Šumperk, Bruntál, Krnov, Jesenice or, for example, in the northern Plzeň and Vysočina regions. There is no work and people are leaving.
The villages in the Elbe, which have several hundred inhabitants, do not have a problem. While in the Českolipsko region, only twenty kilometers away, there are villages with several inhabitants, where the problems are much greater. This can be seen very much in regions that are only a few tens of kilometers apart.
So in one district we find a prosperous village and at the same time a village that is in danger of extinction due to the large exodus of the population?
Yes, take the countryside in the Benešov region in the Central Bohemian Region, for example. The villages near Čerčany are developing very well. There is a rich cultural and social life, because there are a lot of inhabitants and vacationers and some of them live there permanently, because they are not far from Prague.
Then go see East Vlašim, which is in the same district. There are small villages around Pravonín, Načeradka. There are fewer inhabitants, a lot of seniors, in winter only a fraction of people remain. It looks like the end of the world. I am exaggerating to say that even if you cut yourself, you will not make Pacov London. The location is important in whether the community will or will not be disturbed.
When you mentioned the Central Bohemian Region, how many Praguers longing to move outside the capital can still hold?
Hard to say. I know that when I wrote an article in 1991 about the capacities in the municipal zoning plans, I naively laughed at the fact that such development was not possible in twenty years. And it turned out to be. I made a mistake. The fact that the population of the region is growing, however, does not mean that there is better quality housing. On the contrary. Social and cultural life may be completely missing there. People come to the gate by car, close behind them, and slowly don’t even know who their neighbors are. This is the case with some satellites.
I think that the population growth in the Central Bohemian Region is slowly coming to a halt. People do not move behind the rings formed by the district towns in the region, they do not want to commute so far Praguers no longer look for such places as an alternative to housing. Maybe the covid and work from home will get away with it.
So won’t other regions outside Central Bohemia “relieve” Prague?
I don’t think so. a large county town has its own background, to which people move. Brno or Plzeň have large facilities, as well as Ostrava, Zlín, Hradec Králové with Pardubice, Ústí nad Labem. People from Hradec, for example, move to Kunětická hora or Jaroměř, to relatively large municipalities where there is housing, school, trade, public transport, and from there to work in Hradec.
But I don’t think the people of Prague are moving on. They still move mostly to the Central Bohemian Region and also individually to the places to which they have a relationship, for example from there, they have a cottage there. But it’s not a big wave. Once you have a family, the connection to the place is much bigger, the transfer is not so easy.
Would you say that the Czechia is divided into Prague and the rest of the republic?
The phrase “we have never been so divided” is a myth, as is Bohemia versus Moravia or Prague versus Brno. It’s an easy media acronym. We can compare municipalities according to various indicators – economic, income, environmental quality. From the point of view of the environmental load curve, living on Wenceslas Square is basically comparable to the situation before the heart attack. In the Vysočina region, the opposite is true. From the point of view of the possibilities of social contacts, Prague is doing great and Vysočina is the end of the world. So let’s not divide. Jokes about the others are just color.
Is it possible to break down the prejudices that people from cities and rural areas have towards each other?
I don’t think so. But it is a mistake on both sides. When you come from the city to the countryside and want to get involved in the local community, you come across a fire that will give a lecture on the philosophical anchoring of Martin Heidegger, or a gentleman who will talk about string theory. And again, you’ll mind if someone turns on the mower at half past five in the morning.
A different life cycle can be the cause of many conflicts and science to distinguish between airmen and locals. That is, those who are at home in the countryside, and foreigners who have been going there for about fifty years, for example, but still do not want to talk about the development of the village. If they manage to break it on both sides, if the Luftians learn that in addition to a lecture on Heidegger, they should also come to a concert of a local band, they will make it possible to find a common language and an agreement. But it doesn’t always work out.
Do you think politicians pay enough attention to rural depopulation?
I think that little attention is paid to this topic, but a little more than, for example, ten years ago. The Ministry of Regional Development has a Rural Development Concept. We also have a number of programs that concern rural development. It is dedicated to the Association of Local Authorities connected with the Mayors and the Independents, and the Association for Rural Renewal, chaired by MEP Veronika Vrecionová (ODS).
But it is not a political issue in principle, but rather about finding a common way to support rural development. And it doesn’t work out, or rather somewhere, somewhere less.
So it doesn’t work?
Overall, I would say that it is doing less at the moment than it could. Much more could be done to develop rural areas. The big question is what the situation in Ukraine will do with that. 300,000 people came to the Czech Republic who need to live somewhere. This means great demographic potential for rural development if they find work there. For example, agriculture is constantly short of labor.
When we find a place for Ukrainians to live in the municipalities, they may even find a job there, they will help fill the school and at the same time they will help the municipalities that are on the verge of survival. If these people have nowhere to go and get stuck here, they may have their own future.
When you mention rural schools, how are small classes doing today?
The problem with small classes is how active they can be and therefore interesting for their parents. The younger generation of the population is gradually disappearing from some peripheral areas, and the countryside is gradually disappearing. That’s why there are fewer children, so fewer pupils and schools are fighting for them to survive. There are schools that have a very small number of pupils because they stagnated sometime in 1975, and there are progressive schools with a larger number of pupils because they have good publicity or because they are interesting.
Small class almost family care, individual approach. On the other hand, these schools suffer from the fact that there are only a few teachers – so whatever the teacher is, so is the whole school. If the teacher is no longer so active, his enthusiasm for learning fades, then the quality of the whole teaching begins to decline and parents prefer another school.
Do schools manage to remain in “dying” villages, from which, for example, shops, restaurants, post offices have disappeared?
School is the first thing that disappears in such a village. If there are not at least fifteen such children, he cannot survive. While fifteen regulars or a tourist shop or pub will keep. At the same time, the municipalities are very much fighting for the preservation of the school and it is very damaging if they have to close it. Now the placement of Ukrainian children who came to the Czech Republic can help them – there will be no place for them in Prague, but they will be easier to find in Pelhřimov, Rakovnicko and Jesenice. The question is whether their mothers will find work there…
When we ask ourselves whether a pupil will go to a small class to a neighboring village or ten kilometers to a district town, then he will go to a larger school, if the small one is not interesting at all. In addition, the large school offers clubs, rings. Children often ride with their parents who work in the county town. However, I also know the example of a small school that was established in the village of Chříč (Plzeň-sever), where a group of people from Prague came. First they founded a brewery there, then a school. It is called Pivoňka because it was founded by brewers. However, some schools work in the same way as in the 1980s, and parents do not want to put their children there.
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